Here's my transcript of the IRC chat from the Berkman Thursday Weblog Writers meeting, on Dec 11, 2003.
Have fun!

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<Lawrence>we rule
<JakeSavin>Not sure if anyone else sees this, but the URL for the webcast is the same as last week.
<Lawrence>yeah, first thing i tried
<Lawrence>I thought it was cancelled when Dave said the webcast might not go through, then I refreshed and saw that it might happen
<Lawrence>What time does the meeting usually start?
<Lawrence>We know the URL =0
<JakeSavin>7 EST
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<je_apostrophe>does that work?
<JakeSavin>that's the webcast
<Lawrence>we are listening
<je_apostrophe>nice, we're good!
<JakeSavin>(same as last week)
<Lawrence>The URL from last week works
<Lawrence>Yeah we hear you
<JakeSavin>can't hear it well
<JakeSavin>sssh so we can hear
<JakeSavin>welcome back kotter
<Lawrence>Jake is too cool
<Lawrence>Jake we bow in your presense
<JakeSavin>(trying to find my mp3 recorder)
<je_apostrophe>it will be archived for later
<je_apostrophe>i'll take care of giving dave the file for scripting
<JakeSavin>oh -- so no need to record?
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<sanskritboy>What's up, party people?
<JakeSavin>(bang crash!)
<Lawrence>RIAA raid
<sanskritboy>Too bad we don't have an iSight.
<sanskritboy>We could all do synchronized dancing for the audience.
<JakeSavin>who's sanskritboy?
<Lawrence>Think he's at the meeting...
<je_apostrophe>sanskritboy -> Ryan Overbey
<je_apostrophe>he's really here
<sanskritboy>I am really here, yes!
*je_apostrophe is Jay McCarthy of
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<DaveScripting>hey hey hey
<Lawrence>hey Dave
<DaveScripting>any requests?
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<DaveScripting>this is so multimedia
<DaveScripting>can you all hear the music
<MarcN>Hey I just heard my 'beep' on your IRC client
<Lawrence>yeah, it's coming through fine
<MarcN>some crappy 80s ballad is playing
<morphex>what are you guys listening to?
<je_apostrophe>Christopher Lydon, , enters!
<Kevin_Marks>hi dave
<morphex>Kevin_Marks: got the link, thanks
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<Lawrence>listening to webcast
<MarcN>Can you speak up?
<MarcN>I'm listening too.
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<MarcN>Cranking my volume seems to work ;-)
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<DaveScripting>how is the quality?
<morphex>it's ok
<JakeSavin>seems alright
<Lawrence>sounds good here
<morphex>a bit low volume though
<adamhill>its OK in Texas
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<morphex>this is soo nice, listening to voices instead of reading text
<kaye>i wish they were closer to the mic
<kaye>it's hard to hear on my laptop
<kaye>loud -- good
<kaye>not really
<MarcN>Sounds okay, but a little bit of a buzz or something.
<kaye>i will be quiet to hear every word
<adamhill>i still have to have it turned all the way up to hear them
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<adamhill>but it is audible
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<MarcN>I saw Dean last week in NH, and the internet was never mentioned.
<kaye>But from my position the only people he has touched has been the upper middle class white vote.
<ad>that's the only person any candidate has touched on
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<kaye>that is legit, ad
<ad>so he should've turned down the endorsement?
<kaye>you're right
<ad>that doesn't make any sense. if you're a candidate, you don't turn down a voter
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<je_apostrophe>i just shoke my hand in agreement
<je_apostrophe>you didn't see it
<AreEmmKay>isn't online money affecting offline politics pretty important?
<Stewart>wait a second ... is this #atomdev?
<kaye>should he have turned it down ... good question
<Stewart>sorry, wrong room ...
*Stewart apologizes
<ad>i don't think dean knows what's cool about the 'net
<ad>which is fine, most people don't
<kaye>at my research mtg today we talked more about why gore did it -- some of the people there said this was Gore snubbing his nose at the party since they were adamnet that he shouldn't/couldn't run again
<AreEmmKay>not in any idealistic sense
<ad>he says something good is coming of it, and that's a good step for someone to learn about it
<ad>to motivate him
<MarcN>I've gone to a bunch of stump speaches and the internet is never mentioned.
<ad>yep, but that's fine. most people don't care about the 'net
<ad>phones aren't mentioned either
<ad>he's snubbing the phonosphere!
<ad>and i bet they raise more money on the phone than they do on the web
<kaye>i still think that you have to take the money from where ever you can earn it & put it into the avenue that will most get you elected
<ad>right, that's their job
<kaye>isn't that what contributors want when they give money? to get the person elected?
<ad>i don't think anybody donated in order to promote blogs
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<ad>they don't get it? they're great at the business they're in
<ad>i mean, if they were saying "i know what's best about outlining", people would say they have no credibility
<Stewart>hear hear
<sanskritboy>Michael is
<ad>the only way they know how to empower people
<ad>is by getting themselves elected
<ad>they're not trying to make it easier for people to read the Times
<MarcN>Because of RSS I check my amphetadesk page before I hit the various news sites that I used to read.
<ad>well, sure, i love syndication
<ad>but why would a presidential candidate evangelize syndication?
<ad>that's dave's job!
<kaye>ad's comment is very interesting in light of this personal mission jeff jarvis is on --- he's sending money & cameras & support to iraqi bloggers so their voices can be heard
<ad>yeah, definitely
<ad>howard dean never *claimed* to be a friend of the internet
<ad>that's words in his mouth
<MarcN>Blogs give a way for people with similar interests to keep each other informed. That can cause political action.
<ad>he said "i didn't know anything about it, and the 'net has turned out to be interesting"
<kaye>i agree with MarcN
<MarcN>Imagine if Florida happened today -- there would be tons of blogs on both sides getting their word out.
<ad>i totally agree. but from any candidate's perspective
<ad>it's *already* caused political action
<Stewart>And, let's be frank here -- blogs are a hobbyist phenomena - Dean isn't doing a lot to support skeet shooting or needlepoint or bridge either
<MarcN>you would have law geeks tracking stuff, political hacks with their spin, etc
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<ad>yep. there are more knitting blogs than warblogs, still
<ad>and nobody's kowtowing to that audience
<AreEmmKay>I would vote for the skeet shooting candidate
<ad>me too
<ad>or jai alai
<ad>i thought dave just said he didn't lose?
<MarcN>I think blogs got a bunch of people to form around a candidate which gave Dean the ball rolling....
<ad>oh, they can't see me?
<ad>i was answering dave
<Stewart>hey people in the room - if you can see this say "I C IRC"
<AreEmmKay>is this being projected on the screen, like at bloggercon?
<ad>most normal people, gore is the only democrat they've heard of
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<ad>of all these candidates
<AreEmmKay>IC IRC
<ad>or whomever jay leno mentions
<Stewart>ah, ok - thanks!
<kaye>IC IRC
<kaye>yes, rather
<kaye>interesting point -- if you blog about it is it your business?
<kaye>(hi red)
<MarcN>For example the diebold voting machine issue can cross over to mainstream if enough bloggers chat it up and get noticed by big media.
<ad>nah, it's too obscure to explain
<ad>yeah, but you catch more flies with honey
<Kevin_Marks>diebold is crossing over
<ad>i hope so
<Kevin_Marks>Krgman in NYT covered it
<ad>it's so complicated, though
<AreEmmKay>Matt Gross for president in 2008?
<Stewart>"*the* smart bloggers"?
<ad>half the people support bush
<MarcN>Kevin_Marks: yes, and probably because there was a bunch of chatter about it that someone in big media noticed it!
<Kevin_Marks>Cringely too
<ad>who else is he going to pay? blogs are decentralized?
<ad>if he could make a buy across a million blogs for a million bucks, he'd do it
<ad>but there's no infrastructure
<ad>doubleclick doesn't serve blogs collectively
<ad>but the web has helped dean
<ad>do you think he's more likely to do work like that
<ad>to help the web
<MarcN>Similar to blogs, the whole opensource/gnu work came into its own with the web
<ad>after he gets elected?
<ad>or is some other candidate more likely?
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<ad>i mean, you have to do the math. those who the web helps most are most likely to reciprocate
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<Kevin_Marks>deans web principles statement is good - largely 'cos it was written by Weinberger
<Kevin_Marks>Hoder is running in Iran
<kaye>but you shouldn't vote or support someone just because (s)he blogs -- it should be the content within the blog
<ad>i wonder if hoder passes the pro-blog litmus test
<kaye>that would be like me voting for someone because she is a woman
<ad>right, exactly
<ad>the best candidate might not have a blog at all
<ad>and therefore would give exactly as much money to the web as dean does
<Kevin_Marks>well, he has made Iranian blogs really popular
<ad>but dave criticizes dean
<ad>and not, say, sharpton. whose web presence is a joke
<ad>yeah, hoder's done terrific work
<MarcN>So if Limbaugh 'got' blogs would you support him?
<ad>but if he got elected, i'm sure he'd focus on core human rights
<ad>and dave's saying it's more important what he does for the web
<Stewart>also, at some point ...
<kaye>unfortunately, it's coming down to uneducated voters making decisions based on pretty web sites
<Stewart>"What happens when you combine a weblog tool with an aggregator? Haha. I should have it working in time for tomorrow night's weblog writer's meeting."
<Stewart>enough teasing
<MarcN>Stewart: do you get blosxom + blagg? ;-)
<Stewart>I thought that's what Radio was, but I've never actually seen the app
<Kevin_Marks>lets dissolve the electorate and bring in a new one, Kaye?
<kaye>im more for engaging the current one -- because i don't things are all that bad
<kaye>unless you are going to elect me, kevin :)
<ad>i agree
<ad>most voters are great, people just don't respect them
<kaye>i heard an academic presentation last month about non-voters -- they say they don't vote becuase they don't know enough ... when in fact they are actually very educated people
<Kevin_Marks>I don't get to vote - taxation without representation is the Englishman's lot in America
<ad>right, there's an insecurity thing
<Jerf>the more you know, the more you know you don't know
<morphex>is this webcast getting stored anywhere?
<kaye>yes, ad.
<ad>and it maps very closely to how gender affects job applications
<ad>equally qualified women and men going for the same job that's slightly above their level
<ad>the men tend to assume they can do it, and the women say they're unqualified
<ad>i think people see voting like that
<kaye>yes -- i think it also has a lot to do with our changing edu system (college)
<kaye>i *heart* rss
<je_apostrophe>thanks kaye, it hearts you too
<kaye>it saved my bloglife during my phd qualifying exams
<kaye>lol, thanks jay -- cause you're on my list :)
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<ad>i love syndication in general
<ad>i'm not picky about technology :)
<kaye>what else do you syndicate ad?
<je_apostrophe>rss took my life away... 950 feeds and counting
<kaye>ohmigod jay!
<ad>i had worked with NewsML feeds in the past
*sanskritboy tries to do the math
*sanskritboy 200 new feeds in 2 months?
<ad>or even email newsletters, whatever
<ad>it's a great thing though
<ad>a good way to lose your life :)
<je_apostrophe>we're looking at that
<kaye>thanks! i had missed the URL
<MarcN>There needs to be a firefly (remember them?) for RSS. Look at what I currently read and recommend others based on people with similar interests.
<Kevin_Marks>Buzz cites iranian Prez on blogs:
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<MarcN>people at berkman -- read my comment. we need firefly for RSS
*gregor waves
<ad>collaborative filtering for blog reading?
<ad>aren't there lots of people doing that?
<Stewart>MarcN - Kinja is doing that
<Kevin_Marks>After President Khatami mentions the explosion of weblogging in Iran, Daily Summit asked: do you use weblogs, Mr President?
<Kevin_Marks>"I do not use weblogs," the President replied. "But I do not use many good things. My own daughters do not have weblogs but they are very active in using the internet and chat. Our youth and adolescents during high school - and university - are using weblogs very extensively. In universities, there is a lot of access and there are many internet cafes in Iran. Access for youth to the internet is very satisfactory."
<MarcN>ad: not filtering, but suggesting related rss.
<je_apostrophe>we meant categorizing the feeds and organizing place to find them
<gregor>i wonder if i should take some pictures of the meeting?
<ad>kinja is the lafayette project?
<Stewart>yep, same thing
<ad>right, i meant filtering the universe of all blogs down to suggestions
<kaye>someone should photoblog it
<gregor>we are not cool enough to have camphones
<MarcN>ad: the way firefly worked is it listened to music you played and based on that compared it to music other people were listening to. So if I like talking heads, R.E.M., it would find others listenin to that and suggest something else they listen to to me.
<MarcN>Stewart: url for kinja?
<gregor>however, ole regular digicam: can do.
<ad>yeah, that's what collaborative filtering is
<ad>maybe just two names for the same thing
<je_apostrophe>if a demo starts it will be difficult to describe what's going on but we'll do our best
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<MarcN>ad: filtering I see as a way to limit something (spam filter, porn filter). pointer to kinja?
<ad> looks like it hasn't launched yet
<ad>right, it's limiting the set of all blogs to just hte ones that your friends like
<Stewart>(sorry - was away)
<Stewart>yeah - there is not a lot of info public yet
<MarcN>ad: okay. sounds about right.
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<GregGersh>So is Kinja a way to make Group Blogs?
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<Stewart>no - it's like amazon recommendations, but for blogs (AFIAK)
*gregor pondering why his wifi is so flaky
<Stewart>you like and Fleshbot? we suggest ...
<MarcN>Stewart: yup, a suggestion service.
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<sanskritboy>The opml example is
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<MarcN>sounds like a great tool for spamming blogs!
<kaye>it would also scare me that i would post something in the "wrong place" (seeing as how i disagree with lisa williams' JUST ONE BLOG philo)
<kaye>but it's a kewl tool
<AreEmmKay>I collect blogs like crazy old women collect cats
<MarcN>kaye: what is the purpose of multiple blogs?
<kaye>professional blog
<kaye>personal blog
<kaye>thursday blog
<kaye>(just kidding)
<AreEmmKay>behind the firewall-at-work-blog
<kaye>exactly (dave & michael)
<MarcN>So Lydon is really writing for multiple magazines.
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<MarcN>How is that different for writing for different magazines with different audiences?
<kaye>MarcN: i think it is the same - only more frequent
<kaye>jay is my hero
<kaye>im here
<MarcN>looks like typo in html code.
<Lawrence>The HTML in the post to Berkman is encoded...
<MarcN>image name is allegedly 32.gif"
<Lawrence>&lt;img src="" width="72" height="60" border="0" align="right" hspace="15" vspace="5" alt="A picture named 32.gif"&gt;
<Lawrence>That's why the image isn't showing up...
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<Blogdigger>So this tool routes the same post to differnt blogs?
<sanskritboy>Nevermind, that requires a password. =)
<Blogdigger>Is that the gist?
<kaye>*warning* off topic: I meant to say this earlier, has a neat graph of link text of the prez candidates: /off-topic comment
<MarcN>Dump all the entries in a database and then publish various views to various urls. Big deal.
<Blogdigger>Doesnt Radio do that now with multiple Categories/Blogs? OH I see, it uses MetaWeblogs API to do any blog.
<JakeSavin>right -- that's what's special about it (MetaWeblog API) -- if I understand correctly
<Blogdigger>So Channel Z is like a Meta Weblog for all the blogs on the server.
<AreEmmKay>i guess they could live anywhere
<Blogdigger>It gives you a top level view of all the people on the server.
<Blogdigger>Yes, they could live anywhere.
<MarcN> has my nh posts (in chono order) and blosxom/linux is only linux stuff.
<JakeSavin>MetaWeblog API -- seems to me that they don't have to live on *one* server -- could be anywhere that the API is supported
<MarcN>simple apache hacking to could have different domain names...
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<Blogdigger>Got it Jake, so anyone can add to Channel Z...
<JakeSavin>I think anyone using the channel z software could send to any blog that supports metaweblog api
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<sanskritboy>Jake: That's right.
<JakeSavin>haven't used the software myself though, so I may be misunderstanding
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<AreEmmKay>Is someone from Omni there?
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<sanskritboy>AreEmmKay: Nope. They're in Seattle, no?
<AreEmmKay>I think so... I think I just heard something wrong.
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<MarcN>someone talking about linux-based stuff? can't hear.
<GregGersh>I think they're talking about outliners?
<je_apostrophe>Spoiled again!
<je_apostrophe>did i mean foiled?
<je_apostrophe>that is YOU
<AreEmmKay>too bad, none seem to be geotagged
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<Lawrence>hey eric
<je_apostrophe>we're getting ready to figure out where we'll eep
<kaye>oh no!
<kaye>a month?
<je_apostrophe>there will be a meeting next week actually
<MarcN>je_apostrophe: you'll all invited to my house for pizza!
<je_apostrophe>but then after that is Xmas and new years
<kaye>oh, so just michael not meeting
<AreEmmKay>Meetings are in Harrisburg, PA until then
<kaye>we should do it in sunny gainesville fl
<kaye>any takers?
<MarcN>I'll likely be here.
<AreEmmKay>I can get to baltimore
<wiredfool>I could do dc area the week of christmas
<MarcN>blogs and RSS in the porn industry ;-)
<GregGersh>Not too far from Harrisburg - I've made it in an hour...
<wiredfool>so have I actually
<MarcN>I'm southern NH. Stop by ;-)
<Rod>I'm in Sunny FL
<kaye>DAVE - can you do a wiki for the agenda so we can put items on it?
<wiredfool>but that was when I was younger and didn't care about speedlimits
<AreEmmKay>does anyone get to the weblogger meetups? ours never happens
<Kevin_Marks>My 2nd anniversary just went by
<GregGersh>Baltimore happens sometimes, but I havent made it yet.
<wiredfool>seattle's weblogger meetups normally attract 10-15
<MarcN>AreEmmKay: I got one, but no one signed up.
<kaye>don't know how
*MarcN not really sure why I got it...
<kaye>would LOVE to learn
<AreEmmKay>I always get the "not enough people" email
<Kevin_Marks>just annex bits of womeone else's wiki
<Kevin_Marks>Joi would let you
<AreEmmKay>wiki squatting
<GregGersh>Yeah, that happened for us for a while, now they try and organize it off as well.
<MarcN>AreEmmKay: Not that I could ever attend. Pretty housebound with a ton of kiddies.
<GregGersh>Dont do it on Yom Kippur
<GregGersh>BloggerCon that is...
<je_apostrophe>Kevin_Marks: So can we just grab "BerkmanThursdays"?
<kaye>i will look into then -- i have been so tasked ... kevin you might get an email from me :)
<je_apostrophe>join the mailing list for the meetings as well
<kaye>in that case -- it might take me awhile -- ha ha
<kaye>yes, i am
<kaye>alright - im logging out, but first:
<AreEmmKay>is it a yahoo group?
<kaye>id like to give a shout out to all my homies at the berkman center
<je_apostrophe>yes... i can look it up and put it up on when i get home
<Kevin_Marks>wiki page created
<kaye>you RULE kevin !!
<je_apostrophe>should be that?
<AreEmmKay>I thought about instead of blogging, posting on random wikis.
<Kevin_Marks>I can't stand the advertising and spam on yahoo
<kaye>have a good nite all
<je_apostrophe>correct link:
<Kevin_Marks>plus I can anever remeber the dumb userid I got stuck with
<je_apostrophe>night kaye
<je_apostrophe>peace in the middle east
<MarcN>AreEmmKay: have you see the blosxom / wiki integration?
<Kevin_Marks>isn't there an RSS feed?
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<AreEmmKay>MacN: no
<Kevin_Marks>no more mailing lists for me
<AreEmmKay>Yahoo group RSS feeds suck ass
<MarcN>AreEmmKay: and poke around.
<Kevin_Marks>tom says 'RSS' shoudl eb pronounced 'Arse!'
<AreEmmKay>I've had blosxom up and running before
<wiredfool>blosxom's pretty slick
<MarcN>AreEmmKay: That's my bloggin app of choice.
<Kevin_Marks>there's s away to get rss out of moinmoin
<AreEmmKay>I'm between that and bybloxsom for the localfeeds news page
<wiredfool>I'm using it for a 'private blog' on my laptop
<sanskritboy>Night folks
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<wiredfool>for consulting notes and such
<Kevin_Marks>stop making me hungry
<Kevin_Marks> it's not dinner time here for hours yet
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<MarcN>One slice of green pepper and onion pizza at my house....
<wiredfool>my purr programming companions are demanding dinner
*AreEmmKay crys
<Lawrence>happy trails to you
<MarcN>should have a roll call in irc
*MarcN is
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*AreEmmKay is and
*GregGersh is, among others,
<bitsko>for MoinMoin's rss feed, go to the RecentChanges page, there's an [RSS] link there
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